What if your website could write, test, and improve itself without anyone lifting a finger?

In this episode of Executive Connect, host Melissa Aarskaug sits down with Josh Payne, Founder and CEO of Coframe (and former co-founder of Autograph with Tom Brady), to explore how AI is changing marketing from the ground up. Josh shares how smart websites are learning in real time, optimizing themselves 24/7, and driving growth without large teams. They dive into the difference between co-pilot and autopilot AI, why marketing to AI agents is the next frontier, and the danger of “comfort work” for founders. Josh also opens up about the role of music in staying sharp and why creativity is key to leadership in the AI era.

Chapters
00:00 Intro: AI websites that run themselves
01:09 Josh’s journey: Startups, Tom Brady, and AI
04:45 What Coframe actually does
07:07 The power of speed and constant testing
09:52 Will rapid changes hurt SEO?
11:16 What autonomous AI can really do
15:53 The trap of “comfort work”
21:01 How music keeps Josh grounded
25:24 The future of marketing: AI agents and personalization
33:16 Final thoughts and how to start using AI today

Josh

(0:00) You’re asking about what does the world look like when AI can help optimize 24×7. (0:05) Well, it looks like a world where your website is constantly and continuously changing based on what it’s learning over time. (0:14) So we’re constantly kind of creating this endless learning cycle, and the website should then, as a result, be adaptive to changes in how the world is.

(0:24) It should be personalized to each and every user. (0:27) It should be continuously improving itself over time. (0:31) And that is a world in which it’s both better for the consumer, you know, the person coming to the website and experiencing it and going and trying to figure out ultimately what they want.

Melissa

(0:39) Most marketers are still trying to figure out how to use AI and save a little time. (0:47) Josh Payne is using it to make websites that literally rewrite themselves for higher conversations without even lifting a finger. (0:57) He’s the founder and CEO of CodeFrame, the only marketing tech company partnered with open AI, and he’s already helped brands generate millions in extra revenue.

(1:09) Before that, he co-founded Autograph with Tom Brady, sold another startup, Tata Group, created the first major autonomous AI agent for code generation, and somehow still finds time to play timpani with the San Francisco Philharmonic. (1:28) Today, on the Executive Connect podcast, he’s here to talk about the future of AI marketing and why the most valuable marketers on your team might not be human. (1:41) Welcome today, Josh.

Josh

(1:44) Thanks so much for having me, Melissa.

Melissa

(1:45) So excited to chat with you. (1:48) Now, your background is fascinating and your background spans NFTs with Tom Brady, enterprise acquisitions, open source AI projects, and now marketing tech. (2:02) Not a normal flow.

(2:04) What’s the common thread that runs through all of these different interests and businesses you’ve been a part of?

Josh

(2:11) Oh, man. (2:12) Great question. (2:14) Yeah.

(2:14) I mean, one thing that’s common across all of them, if I look across what drove me to get involved in each of these things, it was really just natural curiosity and intrigue and following my heart and where I wanted to go and explore. (2:29) Maybe at a high-level look from the 30,000-foot view, it doesn’t look super connected, but the arc has, at least to me, has felt pretty connected. (2:39) But one thing that I actually can ascribe to being similar across these dimensions is a focus on using next generation of technology to make customer experiences better.

(2:53) So making our experiences as humans on the internet with these digital interfaces, make that a great experience. (3:02) So for instance, with my first company, Access Bell, we were powering telemedicine for largely people in India, which is why we sold to Tata Group, which is a huge conglomerate in India. (3:15) And we had identified the problem in the customer experience that at least in areas in rural India, bandwidth was very low.

(3:26) So it was tough to access the internet, but people still needed telemedicine. (3:30) And so we developed a solution that allowed for low bandwidth connections with high latency and allowed people to connect with their doctors despite a bad internet connection. (3:43) And so that was the first business.

(3:46) Then as crypto was on the rise in the last cycle, me and my co-founders identified an opportunity to make this way more accessible to the everyday person and bring them into it. (4:04) And that was the whole thesis behind Autograph. (4:07) And now with Coframe, this is actually at the core of what we’re doing, which is helping other companies make their own user experiences more effective and accessible, and ultimately kind of have a better connection with their customers.

(4:21) So I think that’s a common thread that I’ve seen throughout.

Melissa

(4:25) Yeah, it’s really interesting. (4:27) The concept for me, AI marketing that runs itself in and of itself is so fascinating. (4:32) I just think about how much work marketing has been, is, and is always.

(4:36) So let’s talk about what Coframe actually does. (4:40) Let’s unpack that a little bit and from your perspective.

Josh

(4:45) Sure. (4:46) Yeah. (4:46) Coframe at a very high level is an AI growth team.

(4:51) So at least in Silicon Valley, a lot of companies, there’s been this new term or this new role that’s emerged, which is called growth role. (5:01) Someone who’s essentially responsible for a key metric that is important to the business. (5:06) And the way that you increase that metric typically is by running experiments and testing out different hypotheses.

(5:15) It could be testing out different variations of your website. (5:19) It could be finding new channels to acquire users in. (5:24) Whatever it may be, growth is responsible for (5:26) increasing a core metric and a growth team in these companies typically looks like an engineer, (5:34) a growth engineer, someone who’s responsible for actually building out the stuff, a designer who (5:38) can design the different experiences, a growth marketer who is responsible for figuring out (5:44) like what channels are doing the best and in driving more traffic through them. (5:49) And maybe like a growth product manager who’s responsible for constructing and building the product around that. (5:55) And so a growth team is typically pretty expensive to have for this function of driving for a core metric.

(6:04) Each of these roles is expensive headcount costs. (6:08) And so what we’re doing at Coframe is making it easy to have a growth team work on your website 24-7, run experiments and test out different variations of your website without having the insane costs of an actual growth team.

Melissa

(6:26) I love it. (6:27) That’s really interesting to me. (6:29) I think about how many website projects I’ve been part of in my career and they are constant iterations, constant changing, moving everything, adding more, they never end.

(6:41) So I love this idea. (6:42) I’m curious what you see the biggest opportunity with that is. (6:47) Talk to me a little bit about this constant reinventing itself all the time, every day.

(6:53) I know with marketing, before AI, I would say they were sprints. (6:57) In the next 90 days, we’re going to get this, this, this. (7:00) We’re going to upload this, this, this.

(7:02) And now if we’re doing it every day, what is the biggest opportunity there?

Josh

(7:07) Well, in your experience, I’m sure you’re familiar with how annoying it is to change your website and to get something done. (7:15) Oh, man. (7:15) Extremely.

(7:17) The whole story. (7:18) Very annoying, right? (7:19) It usually takes most companies weeks to months to get something changed, get something done on the website.

(7:25) And that’s something that I’ve seen true across virtually every company that I’ve talked to. (7:31) You know, the most elite companies, maybe they can get things done in a week, right? (7:36) Well, at Coframe, we’re operating in the measurement of hours.

(7:40) We’re able to get things done and out on the website in a matter of hours. (7:45) And that’s kind of what sets us apart. (7:48) You know, velocity is the core value at our company, you know, velocity being the rate at which you’re moving and also the direction.

(7:55) And what we’re really focused on helping companies do is create this culture of rapid experimentation, rapid velocity. (8:03) You’re asking about what is the world look like when AI can help optimize 24 seven? (8:09) Well, it looks like a world where your website is constantly and continuously changing based on what it’s learning over time.

(8:18) So we’re constantly kind of creating this endless learning cycle. (8:23) And the website should then, as a result, be adaptive to changes in how the world is. (8:30) It should be personalized to each and every user.

(8:33) It should be continuously improving itself over time. (8:37) And that is a world in which it’s both better for the consumer, you know, the person coming to the website and experiencing it and going and trying to figure out ultimately what they what they want. (8:47) And also for the business, which cares, of course, about that core metric of engagement or conversion rate or revenue or profit or whatever it may be.

Melissa

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(9:10) Don’t just watch act. (9:12) Yeah. (9:12) And I think of, you know, back to your original comment about how difficult it is to change a website and the time.

(9:19) From my perspective, it’s it’s been because of so many stakeholders that were involved in changing, you know, what the messaging is, what the white papers look like, what are we asking? (9:31) How are we gathering information? (9:33) So it’s it’s not only the stakeholders.

(9:36) I also I’m curious about, like, how does that affect SEO and optimization of your website? (9:43) Like if you’re constantly changing it, does it affect like searchability or anything like that when you’re changing it that much?

Josh

(9:52) Yeah, that’s a great question. (9:54) So it can. (9:55) And that’s why it’s really important to be smart about how you’re optimizing.

(9:59) There are ways to avoid the impacts on SEO if you’re using a smart vendor or working with a great in-house team to do this experimentation. (10:09) Google, for instance, highly encourages experimentation they have in their own culture that’s heavily experimentation oriented. (10:16) But there’s a right way to do experimentation that helps to actually increase your search rankings.

(10:21) And there’s a wrong way to do it. (10:23) Of course, at Coframe, we do it the right way. (10:26) And it’s been a lot of time studying that and kind of getting behind that.

(10:30) But there’s certainly a wrong way to do it. (10:32) If you’re constantly changing your site, making very big changes and doing it in a way that is like kind of is confusing the Google bot. (10:41) Yeah, that’s the the bot that goes and scrapes websites to figure out all the rankings and so on.

(10:48) That’s that’s the wrong way. (10:49) So you have to avoid that confusion and make your changes in a smart way.

Melissa

(10:57) Since you mentioned chatbots, I have been highly frustrated with the chatbots on websites lately. (11:04) I feel like, you know, the idea is great, right? (11:07) You want to get help quick.

(11:09) But I don’t think I’m trying to rack my brain. (11:11) I don’t think I’ve ever had a problem solved ever with a chatbot. (11:16) But I know you’ve built GPT Migrate, the first major autonomous AI agent for cogeneration.

(11:25) How close, like talk to me a little bit about that and how, you know, how close are we to seeing the same kind of autonomy and marketing?

Josh

(11:36) Well, that’s a great question. (11:37) And there are a couple of ways where AI is going to transform the world. (11:42) One category is in what you’re referring to as chatbots.

(11:46) That’s what I like to think of as copilot mode, where you have a human in the loop and you’re going back and forth and working with the AI to create an outcome. (11:56) That is currently where most people are experiencing AI today. (12:00) And it’s also where most of the value is coming from.

(12:02) The second category is in this realm of autopilot, I like to call. (12:08) This is where you have human out of the loop. (12:11) And ultimately, you have a fully autonomous system that’s able to do things on its own.

(12:16) The analogy I like to use here is the Iron Man suit versus the Iron Giant. (12:21) So an Iron Man suit, you have Tony Stark in the middle of it, and he’s able to, you know, shoot the blaster and go and fly up high in the sky. (12:30) And but he’s kind of controlling it.

(12:31) You also have Jarvis who’s helping out, but ultimately human is at the helm. (12:36) The Iron Giant, of course, is a fully autonomous robot. (12:40) And so the pattern that we’re seeing is that copilot experiences are today the most powerful way to use AI.

(12:51) Because humans still have a level of insight that hasn’t been achieved by any AI model yet. (12:59) Now, GPT Migrate is a great example of a fully autonomous system. (13:03) The reason why it was unique at the time is it is something where you can point it at a task and then completely take your hands off the wheel, come back in an hour, and then it would be done.

(13:14) Of course, it is something that was very much a proof of concept at the point at which this was built. (13:20) The models have gotten better, certainly. (13:22) But even for that task that I was looking to solve with this project, the models still aren’t good enough to do them at a production-ready scale for most companies.

(13:34) It only works on small code basis. (13:36) And for the audience who is not familiar, GPT Migrate is a tool that helps to migrate code from one language to another. (13:44) So let’s say you’ve written some code that does some type of business functionality in 20 or 30 years ago on a very old stack.

(13:53) Maybe it’s even running on a mainframe computer, which is a very old computer. (13:57) Typically, businesses like to modernize nowadays because that code ends up becoming a liability. (14:03) It’s expensive to run, expensive to maintain.

(14:06) The mainframes can break down. (14:08) And so you want to port it over to a more modern stack. (14:12) But that process of rewriting all that code into a more modern language or framework is very expensive.

(14:20) You’re going to usually hire an outsourced development shop. (14:24) Accenture does a lot of this stuff. (14:26) So does all the big consulting firms.

(14:30) And that’s going to cost you sometimes tens of millions of dollars to do. (14:36) And so GPT Migrate is a project that is aimed to kind of do that autonomously fully. (14:42) And so back to my original point though, most of the value that’s being created in the world today, and actually GPT Migrate is a great example of this because again, the models aren’t quite good enough yet.

(14:54) Most of the value being created today is where a human is actually leveraging AI in a more of a co-pilot scenario. (15:01) So that’s actually how we operate as well at Coframe. (15:04) We have optimization and growth experts who are at the helm for each of our customers and basically able to wield this Ironman suit to do way more and way more effectively than they could possibly do, than the customer could possibly do either with an agency or with an in-house growth team.

Melissa

(15:26) I love it. (15:27) That’s really interesting. (15:28) I’m curious, I always love to talk about lessons learned in our life.

(15:32) I think there’s so much knowledge in the mistakes we make, but you’ve built and scaled companies from zero to unicorn and far beyond. (15:42) For founders that are listening, what are some of the biggest lessons you wish you learned sooner and maybe some of the ways you’ve pivoted since then?

Josh

(15:53) Yeah. (15:54) One lesson I wish I learned sooner was about being susceptible to what I call comfort work. (16:01) Let me explain.

(16:03) Comfort work is what I call any type of work where you actually find yourself in a little bit of a rut doing it, and it’s not actually moving the needle. (16:12) It’s not actually the most important thing for your business. (16:15) A couple of examples here.

(16:16) One example, I really like to code, especially nowadays with vibe coding, as they call it, which is this idea of AI just helping to write the code with you, it’s really, really nice and easy. (16:27) It’s fun. (16:28) Whenever I found myself coding for my business, at least doing a lot of it, I would say, I think it’s okay in moderation.

(16:36) Whenever I’m really, really focused on it, the business tends to just do worse. (16:41) The other functions tend to suffer because I need to be focused on sales and on growth and on operational stuff and recruiting. (16:49) And coding is not one of those things.

(16:53) I’ve handed that off to people who are better than me, much better than me at it, at the company. (16:57) And so I shouldn’t be doing it that much anymore. (17:01) So I like to call this comfort work because I find it kind of rewarding to do it, just sit down and get something done.

(17:09) It feels productive and that’s kind of the risk. (17:12) So with comfort work, the whole point of this is it is comfortable and it makes you feel productive when you actually aren’t doing the most important thing. (17:20) Another example of this is having a full calendar of meetings and maybe feeling even some satisfaction when you’ve gotten through a big full day of meetings.

(17:27) It’s like, oh, I did a lot of work today. (17:29) In most cases, you’ve created negative value because unless those are high value sales calls or if they’re a bunch of internal meetings, that’s actually what I’ve seen kill companies. (17:44) At my last company, Autograph, when we were hitting scale, we ended up being susceptible to this as well, where there was a lot of bureaucracy and a lot of meetings.

(17:55) Everyone had meetings on their calendar. (17:57) I had a full calendar of meetings all day. (17:59) That was not the most important thing for me to do at the time.

(18:02) And so taking a step back, how do we kind of identify that? (18:07) And this is also something I wish I’d learned earlier. (18:10) I’m still learning how to do well today to this day.

(18:13) Just take a step back and think to yourself at a high level, what are the things that regardless of how hard they are, would really move the needle for my company or for myself, even if they’re difficult again, especially if they’re difficult in some cases, because building that ability to do difficult things is actually a core skill. (18:35) It’s like a meta skill. (18:36) If you force yourself to do a cold plunge in the morning or take a cold shower, if you force yourself to go on that run, you’re going to be better at doing the more difficult things that matter for your business as well.

(18:47) There’s actually an area in the brain that develops as a result of this. (18:50) And so if you are able to do those difficult things, then you’re able to identify the things that actually matter and actually execute them and not be stuck in this rut of what I like to call comfort work, which feels productive, but actually is killing your This episode is brought to you by Summit Ventures.

Melissa

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(20:06) I’m like, well, I’ve accomplished so much, but then you’d look and you’d realize you’ve not accomplished anything because you’ve just been setting on meetings for other people’s to-do lists and not actually doing your to-do. (20:18) So since then, I’ve now pivoted my day with writing what I need to get accomplished and not even touching my email box. (20:26) And we’ve kind of morphed into a world of constant CYA and emails.

(20:32) And I’m just going to FYI, let you know and FYI, let you know. (20:36) But I think you’re right. (20:37) It’s easily to get distracted and to take your eye off the ball of what you’re trying to accomplish.

(20:43) And it doesn’t mean we don’t do the things we love and the things that provide comfort. (20:49) We just do them more organized in a way that’s still moving what we’re trying to move. (20:53) So I love that you said that.

(20:54) I absolutely agree with you. (20:57) I want to switch gears and talk about the human side of AI. (21:01) This was a big topic last night at a tech event I went to here in Austin.

(21:06) With all the tech patents and AI projects that you’ve been a part of, companies you’ve scaled, you’re still playing in the San Francisco Philharmonic. (21:17) Talk to me a little bit about that balance between go, go, go, building companies and then finding time to be part of the San Francisco Philharmonic.

Josh

(21:28) No, that’s a good question. (21:29) Yeah, that’s been something that’s been consistent throughout my life so far is having balance for, in my case, music is the thing that keeps me sane. (21:36) And it’s very important for me to continue doing.

(21:39) I’ve been doing music as a core life activity for probably two decades now. (21:47) And so it’s been very, very important for me to continue it. (21:50) I found it helps in other areas as well.

(21:54) When I find myself more active in music, I find myself more creative, more fulfilled in life and better at what I’m doing outside of it. (22:03) And I actually had a period of time a couple of years ago where I didn’t play music because I was living out in LA. (22:10) And that period of time was actually quite challenging for me.

(22:14) I felt myself kind of in a rut. (22:16) I didn’t feel very creative or productive. (22:19) And I actually started flying up to the Bay Area, which is where I’m based, in order to play music again because I had friends up here that I was able to do music with.

(22:29) And so that’s actually been very, very important to me. (22:32) I think for everyone, there exists a thing, like an activity going into nature. (22:37) It could be reading, it could be going and meditating, or it could be painting.

(22:41) For me, it’s music that allows you to maybe unwind isn’t the right word. (22:46) It’s maybe it’s rather express, to express yourself in a different dimension and to activate that part of your brain that maybe like lets the other part that’s kind of involved in work recharge a bit as well. (22:59) And so for me, having that balance has been of utmost importance.

(23:02) And that’s why I make time to play in some of these other groups. (23:07) SF Philharmonic is nice because it doesn’t have a crazy rehearsal schedule. (23:11) You know, there’s like four or so rehearsals per quarter, per concert, you know, and we have concert like three quarters out of the year.

(23:21) And so all in all, it’s like, you know, not a ton of time, but it still is enough to refill that tank, you know, of creativity and music.

Melissa

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(24:18) Yeah, I think that’s such another important part is finding an outlet outside of just work, work, work, work, where you can burn off some stress. (24:27) You can use a different side of your brain. (24:30) I know that has been kind of my through line is finding things that take my mind off the things that I’m working on.

(24:38) And then I come back and I have a fresh perspective versus kind of go, go, go, go, go. (24:43) I love that. (24:45) Yours is music.

(24:46) It’s one of the areas I’ve always endeavored to get better at. (24:49) I just haven’t yet. (24:50) So music is a different side of the brain for me as well.

(24:54) Let’s talk a little bit like, I feel like I don’t even know if I want to ask this question, but my brain is thinking like what’s next in marketing five years from now, but like five years in AI and technology is like 50 years out. (25:07) It seems like this day. (25:09) So maybe I’ll just leave it to you to unpack, but what’s next for marketers, marketing and AI, and what should businesses and people be on the lookout when it comes to AI and marketing?

Josh

(25:24) That’s a great question. (25:25) I’m glad you asked it. (25:26) There are a couple things that come to mind.

(25:30) The biggest thing, the thing that I think is going to be, if we look at the patterns of how people are using technology, the technology, using AI and using the internet more broadly, one of the things that we’re seeing quite a bit is that people are engaging through their like chat interfaces with, with using ChatGPT and using Perplexity and using Cloud. (25:54) And we’ll see, you know, when agent technology ends up becoming more used. (26:00) It’s still in its early days because, you know, OpenAI just launched, just launched its sort of like agent mode.

(26:08) And I know that there’s deep research, people use that a lot. (26:12) What we’re seeing is that people are using these chat clients both to get information and to get things done. (26:19) And so they don’t actually have to go out to the different websites to accomplish what they want to accomplish, to learn what they want to learn and to purchase what they want to purchase and so on.

(26:28) They’re able to accomplish all that more efficiently in the client, in the AI client. (26:34) And so what that means is that there’s going to be an influx of, of agents, which we’d like to call that go out AI, you know, systems that go out and make these decisions on people’s behalf, or at least surface the information to them and go out and find the information for them and take certain actions for them. (26:55) And so marketing is, is an interesting thing.

(26:58) It’s about communicating a value proposition to, in the traditional case, maybe it’s just a one person. (27:05) It’s making sure that you’re communicating properly to, to the, the individual who’s, who’s making the purchase. (27:12) In the B2B sense, it gets a little bit more complicated.

(27:14) You’re responsible for marketing to someone who is sort of like the first layer in the business, but you also have to market to the decision maker, which might be a couple layers in, in the business. (27:29) And so you have to be adept at both sides of it. (27:32) Well, the, this whole idea of, of agents doing things on people’s behalf introduces a new layer of complexity where you need to both market it to the person that is at the end of, you know, making the decision, as well as the agent who is kind of the gatekeeper who is acting on that person’s behalf.

(27:52) And so marketing, I think is going, consumer marketing, at least, is going to involve strategies that actually come from B2B, where you have multiple layers of trying to go through a process to sell something. (28:07) And in a sense, and so it’s going to become more personalized. (28:12) One big, one big area in marketing and B2B right now is, is ABM, account-based marketing.

(28:17) You know, that is an area of marketing where you are trying to specifically target a certain account or a certain persona with like a certain person within the account. (28:26) Like it’s highly personalized. (28:28) It’s one-to-one.

(28:30) I think that that has never been able to be done at a scale for a consumer’s marketing, but now with AI, it certainly can be. (28:37) AI operating on the other side, on the marketer side. (28:40) And then on the flip side, the AI operating on the consumer side, there’s going to need to be basically a way to systematically get better at marketing to the agents, the AI agent that is operating on the consumer’s behalf.

(28:54) There’s this area, it’s TBD, what the acronym is going to be called, but I think AEO is the current, the current front runner. (29:03) Basically this idea of optimizing for AI search engines. (29:08) So making sure that your brand pops up in one of the top results in chat GPT and perplexity and so on.

(29:16) So, you know, the couple of different terms that have been used are AIO or GEO, you know, AEO stands for answer engine optimization. (29:24) GEO stands for generative engine optimization. (29:28) ASO, which is AI search optimization.

(29:32) There’s a lot of terms. (29:33) Anyway, that’s going to be a very important thing for businesses. (29:36) We’re already starting to see a lot of traffic from Google get reduced and people coming from chat GPT and other services like this.

(29:44) We’re starting to also see a way higher conversion rate from people coming from the chat services than they are from Google, which is very interesting. (29:56) And SEO is, as a traditional strategy, is very much, in some cases, it’s failing for businesses. (30:03) It’s not working anymore because of these AI engines that people need to be optimized for.

(30:09) So that’s kind of the trend that I’m seeing here.

Melissa

(30:13) I love it. (30:14) We shall see, Josh. (30:15) We shall see.

(30:17) I’m anxious to hear more. (30:18) Kind of any final thoughts that you want to share with our listeners or anything that we didn’t touch on that you want to leave with them?

Josh

(30:28) Well, something that I found quite useful as I explore in this world of AI is really just getting my hands dirty and playing around with it. (30:36) It’s never been easier to actually take on a task that you might feel was impossible to try before. (30:45) Like, oh, I’ve never coded before.

(30:47) There’s no way I could even get started. (30:50) Or I’ve never marketed before. (30:56) I’ve never run paid media before.

(30:58) There’s no way I could learn at this point in my career. (31:00) It’s never easier to get started with something. (31:02) All you have to do is open up your mind.

(31:06) You have to be willing to explore and also let these systems help you out. (31:13) And so something I really encourage people to do is, if there’s some type of task that you want to accomplish or thing that you want to learn that you haven’t been able to yet, just, like, jump into ChatGPT or Clod and let it help you get started. (31:32) Like, you’ll be so surprised about how capable these systems are.

(31:37) And it’s actually worth paying for, like, a pro subscription to get access to the smartest models on these systems. (31:42) I’m actually, like, shocked at how many people don’t do that. (31:45) And it’s like, wow, it’s just night and day difference in terms of the quality.

(31:48) Like, this is such a game changer that it’s dumb not to pay to, like, get the subscription. (31:56) It can really help.

Melissa

(31:57) 20 bucks or something is super cheap, right?

Josh

(32:00) When you look at, like, again, like, thinking about what the most important thing is. (32:03) Like, comfort work is, like, not working on the most important thing and that’s hurting your business. (32:07) Another thing that is important to do is identify where do you get leverage?

(32:11) Where are the places where you get way higher ROI? (32:14) If you have a system that, like, helps, you know, even by, like, let’s say, even by, like, you know, 20% makes you 20% more efficient versus something that makes you 10% more efficient. (32:27) When you look at the arc of, like, a month of work, even, it is way more valuable to have that 20% boost and pay a little bit for it than it is to have that 10% boost.

(32:37) It’s just, like, you got to think about you have to think about it reasonably, you know? (32:42) Anyway, back to my original point. (32:43) It’s, I really just encourage people to go in and let them, let the systems help you figure out how to accomplish what you want to accomplish.

(32:52) You can go and ask questions like, how do I get started? (32:56) You know, how do I even, you know, how do I, and they’re so helpful. (33:00) They’ll walk you through anything.

(33:02) It’s something that I just, find it so fascinating how most people don’t even use this incredible tool that is now available to us. (33:12) So that’s what I would urge people to go and do. (33:16) And anything that they’re trying to kind of set off and accomplish, it’s very useful.

Melissa

(33:21) I love it. (33:22) That’s great advice. (33:23) I think I would agree with you.

(33:25) I’m shocked more people don’t spend their $21 a month for their subscription. (33:29) Great takeaway for today’s call. (33:32) Josh, what is the best way for our listeners to connect with you, to learn more about Coframe?

(33:38) Is there a website? (33:39) Is there a social channel? (33:40) Tell us the details.

Josh

(33:42) Sure. (33:42) Yeah. (33:43) You can find Coframe at coframe.com.

(33:46) You know, we’re happy and eager to talk to folks and myself personally, you can find me on LinkedIn, you know, just search up Josh Payne should come up. (33:55) I’m always happy to connect.

Melissa

(33:57) Thank you so much for being here and sharing your time and knowledge with our listeners. (34:03) That’s the Executive Connect podcast.